Maddie Thies (she/her). Photo courtesy to Buck Holzemer.
MADDIE THIES
CEDAR COMMISSIONS SPOTLIGHT INTERVIEWS
Over the next few weeks we’re featuring the six artists of the 2021-2022 Cedar Commissions (taking place Friday, February 18th, and Saturday, February 19th at The Cedar) in a series of interviews on our site. The Cedar Commissions is a flagship program for emerging Minnesotan composers and musicians made possible with a grant from the Jerome Foundation.
In the second and now third year of the COVID-19 pandemic where shifts in daily life have been ever-present, these artists have been riding the waves. They’ve been composing, exploring new ideas, and assembling teams of musicians to bring their work to fruition in a mix of virtual and in-person work sessions. Over the two nights of the Eleventh Annual Cedar Commissions, audience members will witness performances about uncovering hidden truths of one's ancestors, uniting African music traditions across drawn lines, illuminating the Third Culture Kid experience, pushing oneself to the ultimate limit, the relational process of self discovery, honoring the disrespected beauty of our planet, and so much more.
Our fourth spotlight interview is with Maddie Thies (she/her). Maddie is a bassist, vocalist, and songwriter. Her project for the 2021-2022 Cedar Commissions Everywhere and Nowhere explores the distinct and simultaneously inconsistent experiences held by Third Culture Kids — a term describing people who spend formative years in a culture different from the culture(s) of their families. In mid-January Maddie spoke with Marketing and Communications Manager Shasa Sartin about finding home in liminal spaces, her love of the bass, and the importance of creative collaboration.
“One of the songs that I have written is called ‘Postcard Collection,’ and there’s a way of writing poetry where you have these little tiny images of prose, and they describe these very brief moments, as you would as you’re flipping through postcards. And it has this way of telling about a flashbulb memory of these very sensory moments within music and in memory as well. So having those kind of quick images and relaying this moment through these small collections. It’s weird, I have that kind of song written and I can just see how it’s supposed to fit on a page and how there’s negative space to it and how music flows between these images.”
Shasa: Your project is titled Everywhere and Nowhere. I would love if you could talk about this title choice — especially the nowhere part.
Maddie: Yeah, so a large concept of my project is identifying as a Third Culture Kid. And what that is, is that you're born into one culture, or what you have is your family, and then you live in a culture that's completely different. So for myself, I was born and raised in Minneapolis, and so I have that US identity, and then I have my time living in South Korea, and that's kind of my second culture. And because I'm a product of both, I have this kind of pseudo-third culture, and that's [that] Third Culture Kid [concept]. I have a lot of these cultural tendencies that are pulled from both.
So a large concept of being a Third Culture Kid is feeling between spaces. There are places where you feel like you kind of belong because of one part of your identity and these other places that you feel like you belong 'cause the other part of your identity, but ultimately you're between a lot of spaces. And so, while you can fit in everywhere, there are also places where you don't fit in at all or that you feel that you have very little in common with folks, and so there's this aspect of ... everywhere and nowhere. And betweenness. And what I can only speak to as a blended identity of sorts.
We had kind of talked about how every space that you enter into, you leave a part of yourself. And so in some aspect, you no longer exist whole in one space because of these other identities that are in these other spaces, kind of like a puzzle where you leave a piece out of yourself in the spaces. So just kind of feeling that you are everywhere because you have had these experiences in various kind of environments and cultures, and I'm sure a lot of people can speak to this too, like the way that you behave in one friend group is very different from how you behave in another. And your comforts with different people and how you choose to either mask yourself or show yourself. Yeah, continuing to have that idea that you are everywhere, and the aspect of you as an individual in the many versions of yourself as infinite, but at the same time, you also are nowhere at the same time.
Maddie playing at White Squirrel Bar in St. Paul, MN. Photo by Tana Ostman.
Shasa: Could you speak to how you feel your musical identity was formed while in Seoul, South Korea?
Maddie: Yeah, I had more of a formal training when I was living in the US, and had more of that classical and jazz influence. And when I went overseas, obviously those kind of were still existing. I was still in various orchestras and was popping in and out of jazz groups and an assortment of musical projects. But I would say the big thing was that I fronted my first band when I was overseas, and it was called Northern Pinnacle, which is kind of funny. The other individual in it, his name is George Dornbach, he's actually from Minnesota and his family also moved to Seoul. And so we'd had this kind of concept of Northern Pinnacle: [with] the northern aspect of [us] being from Minnesota, and that kind of "up north" mentality, and Pinnacle because we were now both living on a mountain in Seoul. And not that that band necessarily spoke so much to that kind of blended identity, but I think in terms of finding a voice and finding styles outside of what I was being taught in these more formal environments, it was really cool to experiment. And to front a project, to add my own voice to a project. I'd been in a choir, but it wasn't really my type of singing.
But yeah, I had just found more of that confidence to be independent and creative and composing in a way. And that really set me up for success in terms of all the various bands that I've been able to be a part of, and we obviously take from those experiences and it informs us as musicians. So I think the ability to be adaptable and to find these little niche spaces ... I find those spaces and I find more in common with those spaces. So I think finding that ability to front projects and to find community within musicians who have had similar experiences. And that's not to say that every project I am able to understand the identity of the people that are fronting the projects. But to at least find community that I love and support, and I can only hope the same of all my projects, that I find those same types of connections too. Not just the content of the music, but the musicianship as well.
George Dornbach (left) and Maddie (right) of their band Northern Pinnacle. Photo byNick Snyder, Logo by Lacey Murray and Julian Murray Photography + Design.
Shasa: How old were you when you did Northern Pinnacle?
Maddie: I think I was a sophomore and junior in high school when that was primarily a thing... Yeah, so those ages.
Shasa: Sixteen and 17. Go little Maddie!
Maddie: I'm not surprised, though. I think I've always sought out music, and that's something that my parents even talk about all the time. They don't know where I saw a violin, but at one point in my life, before I had started kindergarten and daycare, I always was like, "I wanna play the violin," and that's one of the reasons why they had chosen Ramsey [International Fine Arts Center, a K-8 charter school that is now Justice Page Middle School], because they knew that they had a strings program - or I guess now Justice Page Middle School. But yeah, they have no idea where I saw it or how that came to be. And it's the funny story of, I started playing the violin, was really bad at it, obviously, as everyone who starts any instrument is. And it was so squeaky, I absolutely hated it, and I was like, "maybe music isn't for me." And that's when [orchestra director] Pat Kelly, for a year, kept saying, "I see you as a bass player, I see you as a bass player." And finally, I think it was when we were in the third grade, I finally said, "okay, fine, I'll try it." And of course, I loved it.
So I have a lot to thank of Pat Kelly and Stacy Aldrich specifically just for helping me find an instrument. Cause I had always had such a love for music. And you could ask my Dad, for a while before it got stolen out of our car, we had a sub-woofer and I just wanted... I just wanted more sound. And maybe that's why I'm a bass player, I just loved that bass-y, thump-y, sound. I used to call it the Thumper!
Maddie with her current band Ginny & The Fizz. Photo by Wes Pedersen.
Shasa: Do you find that in your own music you align stylistically with that of your current band Ginny & the Fizz? And also, could you describe what we can expect sonically from Everywhere and Nowhere?
Maddie: Yeah. So for the first part of the question, I would say no. My style is a little bit different than Ginny & The Fizz. I think Ginny & The Fizz has some softer stuff, but it's more of like a ballad. And I wouldn't say I necessarily fit into that. And then there's definitely some kind of heavier tunes and I definitely don't have the vocal capacity. Or at least that I've found at this point in time, who's to say where music goes. I don't wanna limit myself. In terms of how I write, I guess from just having sent samples to other folks, people say that it sounds like theres a Grizzly Bear influence, it sounds like there's an Angel Olsen influence. More in that kind of indie-alt vein. But obviously still some singer-songwriter influence.
In terms of what to expect at the Cedar, I think we're still kind of — and when I say we I mean me and Tate Egon — playing with the full ability for sound at this point in time. And that's the one limitations of collaborating with someone online at this point in time.
Genre-wise, I would say definitely in that indie-alt vein. I would say my comfort is obviously in more of a band structure, like rock band structure, just in terms of musician makeup and the ability of that kind of live sound. Tate definitely has some more production abilities beyond what I've really ever dabbled in, and so I think it's very likely to have some more electronic elements. Not in a heavy sense, but more of an ambient kind of way. Just kind of creating space and flow.
We've talked a lot about the intentionality of music, representing space, and at least the way that I write as well. I have a background in writing, and that's what I have my degree in. So the way that I see music almost comes out in a poetic form. For example, one of the songs that I have written is called "Postcard Collection," and there's a way of writing poetry where you have these little tiny images of prose, and they kind of describe these very brief moments, as you would as you're flipping through postcards. And it has this way of telling about a flashbulb memory of these very sensory moments within music and in memory as well. So having those kind of quick images and relaying this moment through these small collections. It's weird, I have that kind of song written and I can just see how it's supposed to fit on a page and how there's negative space to it and how music flows between these images. I guess more conceptually, understanding music and being really intentional with how the two spaces of my identity come together and how I'm able to also visualize memory.
Maddie’s collaborator Tate Egon. They met 10 years ago when they were both in an orchestra at an international school in Seoul, South Korea. Photo by John Gittens.
Shasa: Can you speak more about your collaborative experience with Tate Egon for this project?
Maddie: Yeah, we met overseas about 10 years ago in an orchestra, and it's really cool to see how stylistically and we both have gone in various directions, which is really cool to then have this collaboration and to say like, okay, well, we technically had very similar understandings of sound just from an orchestral standpoint. But then to just see where we've diverged with our musical influences, and just took off running with them is really cool. There's definitely influence of his work in terms of sound, and even lyrically. We've been working pretty closely. I don't ever want to perform with someone and say something they're not comfortable with, or that it's not something that they also stand behind. And I think that's the other thing too, about a third culture identity. Everyone's third culture is different, and how you got to that point is different. It's just very unique. And those experiences that shape you, although they can be universal from a very general standpoint of saying, "I had trouble fitting in" or that "I felt X, Y and Z about coming home," those types of things are very shared. But yeah, [we've] just working lyrically to, one, find the right words, I think is just a struggle in itself. But two, to find ones that are true to both of us or to a universal aspect.
I'm really thankful to have the time to just sit down with him and work on things in that type of way. He's been a really great sounding board in terms of my own musical process, and I think he's helped to push me out of the most literal of writing. Cause my first draft of things I was like, "here's the thing I wrote it, it's very direct," and he's like, "how else can we write it?" I'm very thankful for that 'cause, yeah. It's easy to say that 'this' is the finished product, but nothing's ever really finished. I just have really valued getting to know him again. Which in the time that we had met previously, it wasn't for very long. I think [this is] kind of another Third Culture Kid thing. To just be like, "hi, it's been so long since I've seen you!" And to just pick things up from where they were or to re-establish friendships with this understanding of we were once in a similar space and understanding, and to [now] find ourselves as adults in various places.
Maddie playing the upright bass at 7th Street Entry in Minneapolis, MN. Photo by Tama Ostman.
Shasa: What do you want audiences to take away from your performance when they leave The Cedar on Friday night?
Maddie: There's always artists intent. And what people take away from that is entirely their own, which is a cool thing as well to say, "oh, I've had a completely different experience." And to honor that as well is incredible. I would hope that whether or not people fully identify with the kind of identity or the images that we're creating, that even through sharing that experience, they're finding a place of belonging. That there is a space for everyone and for everyone's narrative. I think it's important to create content for your own identity that you feel is under represented. I guess that's my intention, that's what I'm hoping to create. Finding a sense of belonging within music. Whether you share that same identity with me or not, that there's at least something that you can vibe with. And even if the only thing that we share in that moment is that we were in that same space at that same time, wonderful.
Catch Maddie Thies’ performance of Everywhere and Nowhere premiering live at The Cedar on Friday, February 18th as part of the Eleventh Annual Cedar Commissions. Buy tickets here.